[rant] I am having a hard time deciding on what path to take with my WRX. I sold the JDM 6 speed because the ratios were too short for my liking. I was planning to go PPG but they are so expensive and are on back order for a few more weeks. The next option is an 07 STi tranny. The gears are better but still not quite what I want. Even once I get the tranny sorted out the next issue will be the clutch. Any clutch I decide on that can hold the power is going to be teh suck to daily drive in traffic. I am seriously debating on going back to stock and starting over with a different make of car. Look for a good "for sale" thread coming soon. [/rant]
Built 4EAT will have longer gears but you'll lose the fun factor of shifting your own gears, and it'll cost as much as a PPG gearset. Does anyone make different gearing for the front and rear diffs, like maybe a 3.5 or 3.7 FD? You'd of course have to switch the center diff over to a 1:1 to make it work but it's an option.
You could get the PPG four speed dog box. It will take whatever you throw at it. It would be a bitch to drive daily though.
PPG has finally been broken. There's a thread on Nasioc. Guy in Ukraine broke it. Andrewtech told me the helical and straight cut PPG's aren't recommended for over 400 ft/tq. Yes they are probably stronger than that but if Andrewtech told me that I believe them. Also the price is stupid. 5K for gears and install and that doesn't include the synchros or anything else that may need changing. I simply LOVE my 6 speed. I don't ever look back on my decision to go 07 6 speed. However Mike you will still have to make that 5th gear shift.....
coolrex I saw that thread. I especially love ron (unabomber) immediately blaming it on installation errors. I knew him in virginia, and he's a pretty cool guy most of the time but jesus christ does he come off as a know it all a lot of the time. anyway, it looked to me like straight up metal failure. there was just fatigue at the joint, it just sheared right the fuck off.
I believe the primary issue at hand is finding a gear option that is nearly unbreakable around 600hp that does not require lots of shifting. Spec B and STi for 2007~2008 tops out at like 114mph in 4th @7000. IIRC, Mike is only going to 7000, maybe 7500. With his power level, weight and grip, Its very likely he will need to make the useless shift to 5th (STi) in which you mig as well skip to 6th and risk bogging and surely lose time either way. At least with the Spec B the gearing is MUCH better for 5th and 6th compared to the STi. Soooooooo......either custom PPG gears, or custom 6MT gears...or 4EAT. We are looking for stock like reliability and operation. PPG is out of the question. 6MT seems to be the only choice, however, the gearing is still too short. If there was a 3.545 front final drive for the 6MT, then one could get that ring and pinion set, acquire the 06+ 6MT, acquire the 1:1 transfer gear set to replace the 1.1:1 set in the 06+ 6MT and VOILA!!! longer gearing by a smidge.
:bowdown: Will, if this was real life that would deserve a slow clap. Good luck with your transmission search, Mike!
Also, Once you get into big turbo territory GT35R plus and you start launching it at the drag strip All of the trannys tend to break unless you are very careful. Its not even so much the gears as it is the input shaft, its a very long input shaft which lets it wind up as you load it.....then BAMMM
But on the street the stock 6 speed can handle it all day long right? I went to the drag strip this weekend and lets just say I can't launch the dang thing like I used to with my 5 speed. My traps are there though...
I was told the same. With that in mind the search has been narrowed down to an 07 STi transmission or a transmission from a 2007 STi. Oh well. I'll end with a new transmission and better ratios for less than it would have cost me to get the legacy spec b gears installed in my v7 6 spd. Its not perfect but it will be better.
I sort of looked into that but from what I found they weren't very reliable and end up being as expensive as a ppg gearset.
I have friends with evo's and they don't break that easily like subarus. lol but I was just playing, I would much rather trade my wrx for an audi a3 before I get an evo. lol
http://www.phoenixtuning.com/swaps.html Not too shabby! What I was going to do with my tercel prior to the Suby: Starlet GT Turbo engine swap 91 tercel 30K
What does this have to do with the original post? Back on topic. LiquidForce have you driven Rick's car? All I can say is the 2007 6 speed ISN'T for drag racing. I can't launch this 6 speed like I could my 5 speed man. I've tried and tried and the best I can muster was a measly 1.8 60'. That 1st gear is just too short. My traps are still there and are actually a little better but I just bog the crap out of the launch. With my sticky Nitto's, the addition of a front LSD, and the short ratios I just can't seem to get the tires to break loose like before. The DCCD can be felt trying to keep traction. However I didn't build this car up for the drag strip so I'm not worried about it one bit. I just wanna go fast!
Most guys with over 550hp do start in 2nd FYI. Big Valley did for a long time until they got their dogbox.
I know this. But I was referring to the GM 2nd gear start on their passenger cars back in the 90's...for 'snow use only' :rofl:
subaru still use R160 rear diff? it should be possible to modify a nissan R180 if you got the right axle spline and who knows what other parts exactly? . you can get R180 with the 3.545 ratio. Something like that work? with LGT 6spd
But then you still have no Front LSD, and still have to crack open the transmission to get the speedo sorted out.
Yuh. R160 has been used since 1980 (probably before, as in like 1976 when the first 4WD's rolled off the line) and SUBARU shows ZERO signs of dropping it. Unless you've got an STi (I'm not sure if the 'beca or Spec B has an R180, likely the 'beca does due to weight) you've got an R160. But as far as I know, the SUBARU application for the R180 is 4.444, 3.900 and 3.545. I dont know about JDM ratios for the GC8 STi's...most of them were 4.444. It might be possible that some were 4.111. But I've seen others try to take other maker's R180/200 and make it work in a SUBARU. Its just not worth it IMO.
4.111. The autos have no transfer reduction. The auto WRX (2002~2005) does have a 45:55 tq split tho. Edit: Its an R160 diff.
the 02~05 has a transfer gear reduction. Front diff ratio is 3.900, rear diff is 3.545. How does that happen w/out fucking up the center diff? Easy. Transfer drive reduction. Its 1.1:1 Meaning, the main output from the driven shaft that goes into the center diff is going at x speed. Both the outputs from the center diff match that speed, x. Thus the front ring and pinion are moving at x speed. However, the center diff output for the rear has to go thru a gearset to get the rotation going the correct way. Its not a straight up 1:1, its 1.1:1. It slows it down. The gear at the center diff is smaller than the one that turns the output shaft that drive the driveshaft and rear diff. Thus the rear diff must be 3.545 in order to maintain equal wheel speed when compared to the front. GHEY I know, but rumor is that it was to do with emissions and road loading...something...idk...but they did the same thing for the 06~08 STi too while at the same time taking the 1.1:1 reduction OFF the 06~08 WRX. *shrug* Anyhow, get it now?
for the autos yes. Atleast, for WRX 02~05. The 2.5 RS, 1998~2001 and the 1996~1999 Legacy Outback is 4.444 in auto trim.
Yeah, thank god subaru had some brain then. YOu know for the 08 they took out VDT in the wrx? hello 90:10.
I believe this was part of the original post. "I am seriously debating on going back to stock and starting over with a different make of car" LiquidForce My point being Toyota is a solid option, race any Supra's lately there CoolRex?
VDC is Vehicle Dynamics Control. Pretty much everything from 2008 and onward have this system. Its a full on vehicle traction control system using the G-sensor, Yaw sensor, Steering angle sensor, brake on-off switch, throttle input (and engine load), all 4 wheel speed sensors and a few others. It can be switched off easily on the 'beca and outbacks. However, it seems to be difficult to turn off separate of ABS on the Impreza...aka you have to pull the fuse, but then you have no ABS. VTD is Variable Torque Distribution. This is only found on the Direct 4EAT (D4EAT). Those started in the Foresters at, are in the 02~05 WRX, Outback VDC, Tribeca, and ALL 5DAT's are VTD transmissions. *looks into parts catalog* Indeed, no more VTD for 2008 Impreza and Forester. How sad, as that system ROCKS. You have true AWD ALL THE FUCKING TIME. As far as power split goes...the VTD system was either 45:55 'open' or 50:50 'locked'...there was duty cycle based on slip, 100% (95% on some) being 45:55 as the valve is normally closed, and 0% (5% on some) being 50:50. You do the math for the other numbers in between. Its a planetary diff with clutch plates, similar to the STi DCCD but different at the same time. Its not as complex or as expensive. VTD by itself on a non-BDC car uses 2 vehicle speed sensors to compare vehicle speed 1 (speedo) to vehicle speed 2 (trans output shaft, aka driveshaft) to determine slip and required lockup. The non-VTD is rather simple and, well, it works, but its a poor excuse for AWD. Basically, you have FWD at all times. Duty Solenoid C (DSC) controls the lockup for the trans rear output shaft. Its a set of about 7~9 plates. If you cut power to DSC, you would in theory have 50:50 all the time, right? No...the clutch pack for the rear output is not that strong. Yes, on loose surfaces like sand, mud, dirt, snow, ice the car would act like its 50:50, but on pavement, they slip. The infamous torque bind from people not changing the fluid out or if DSC fails, the binding is not like on the STi where is phyically slips a tyre on pavement (or is nearly breaking something else OR really pissing off the center diff), but the plates slipping. So, in normal operation, DSC is allowed to go to 0% (5% on some) duty in only 1st and 2nd gear. 3rd is limited, only allowed 0% if there is a LARGE speed differential, meaning like 20mph or something and ONLY during acceleration. 4th DSC again is limited, even larger speed diff logic is instated, again only under accel. So, cruising down the road at 65 or so, you are driving a FWD car as DSC is normally at 95%, meaning basically fully open so there's nearly zero lockup. Yeah, you've got a FWD car with a somewhat intelligent system to engage rear wheels only when the TCM thinks its needed. The TCM uses vehicle speed 1 vs vehicle speed 2 to determine lockup. My Outback had horrible TQ bind when I got it back at 153k. Around 190k i swapped the trans fluid and it went away...then I did another trans flush at 220k. Since then ZERO tq bind...but I've also noticed that i get weak engagement when I get front wheel slip. So...it may be time to service those plates. You can buy them from SUBARU as a set, then there is an adjustment snap ring to set the right clearance. I will going to the TIGHTEST clearance as stated in the FSM in order to get max TQ holding capability out of the system. If I went more, it would not be ST* legal.
Speaking of Supras, I was noticing how the 08/09 Impreza/Forester rear suspension is nearly identical to the Supra's. 16 total bushings back there that need replacing. How sad.
I thought the DCCD and the VDT was just dccd without man control. Too many information floating around.
True to an extent. With VDC/VTD together, it could be called DCCD w/out manual control, but it is NOT performance oriented. All it is designed to do is keep the vehicle in a controlled flight. DCCD Auto has a more performance oriented program to it. You could compare it to say...an F-16 (fighter) and an A-6 (Bomber/Attacker) The F-16 (DCCD-Auto) is designed to be more agile and more on the edge, while the A-6 (VDC-VTD) is more stable and way more inside the flight envelope as its primarily a bomber-attacker. Thats not the best comparison, but it should get the idea across.