Got the new engine up and running last night. At first startup it smoked a little and then stopped. After it warmed up and I confirm no leaks, I go out to seal the rings in. Oil smoke galore. Under full vac (full closed throttle) the car doesn't smoke. But as soon as I give any throttle it will start smoking like crazy. The higher up the revs the more it smokes. So what's the guess? Rings? Valve seals? I don't think valve seals leak under acceleration. Too much crank case pressure? My turbo has a restrictor pill on it. It's the right one from ATP turbo.
Yup planned on that too. Right now from memory the lone tube on the AOSep drains into crank case. On the other side there are 3 ports shaped in a L. Port on top of L is open to atmosphere. At idle I can feel air pulsing out of it. Port at bottom left of L plumbs into the head vents. Port on bottom right of L Tee's into the drain at the crankcase vent. There is absolutely no PCV on the car now so that issue in the past on the 2.0 is none existant as that hose is plugged.
Sux dude, wish I had a bit deeper knowledge and could contribute. Since tomorrow is your B-Day (I thought I read somewhere), put the car on the back burner come out to little tally and have a good time with the fellaz.
I wish I could man but 6 1/2 hrs is a haul! I know the issue. That what I get for taking advice for granted but I was told by a very reputable source that I may have to trim the oil control ring a little. Ummmmmm NEGATIVE. It makes sense. The oil control expander scrapes all the oil off the cylinder....if it doesn't hello blowby.
Ben's car did this also till he redid the valve cover vents and installed an air oil separater. We were REALLY worried when it first started doing it, but quickly found out the issue. Check the lines going from the valve cover vents and (not knowing exactly how you have things run) anything going to the turbo inlet.
So you currently have nothing drawing any kind of vacuum on the crank case or valve vents in any way? What is the AOS hooked into? What locations on the block?
Exactly. Do they normally look too big and get 'squished' in when you install them? I remember them being that way and wondering how in the world does it work if the ends were already butting.
It doesn't have to have a vac source. Many vent to atmosphere. Ming himself told me to put a filter on it and it'll be fine. Post #3 has the routing listed and I just confirmed it.
http://www.dragstuff.com/techarticles/vacuum-pumps.html Interesting article, I know the car does not need a vacuum pump, but some of the concepts may apply. Just a thought. Motor was designed to have some crank case vacuum.... Trying to think of anything else other than you having to pull the motor and re-ring it, lol.
Let me clarify this is not just a little smoke. It is a freaking SMOKE screen. It was so bad I could not see the motorcycle behind me in the mirror.
dude... if your oil rings butted up against each other they weren't right. Some things are better left up to the qualified.
Worst thing about this is, if the oil rings did butt up against each other and the car was run like that it would have gouged out the cylinder walls where the ring butted. Making a nice line, which means the motor will need to be re-honed.
The expansion ring is when I'm referring to. The zig zaggy one. Two solid rings never butted and had the recommended clearance. Does the zig zaggy ring ever touch? There was no way in the world that one would go on the piston and not touch!
yes that oil ring always touches, its supposed to expand inside the cylinder to help scrap and control the oil around the piston... if you cut that you will need to pull the motor and replace them.
Expansion ring won't gouge up the cylinder....the two control rings and the two compression rings will though.
Posted at same time! :rofl: Doug I may as well redo all of the rings since I have to buy them anyways right. Only have 5x miles on the car so the hone should be fine I would presume (still gonna check it though).
Only takes one rotation to put a good gouge in the cylinder walls if it's seated funny enough. That could have fucked up on start-up
There is nothing to assembling the engine if you do it right. I trimmed a ring I had no business trimming.....hence I didn't do it right which equals smoking motor. I've built several 500+ hp DSM motors and they are still running 4-5 years later. Subaru engines are a little different so I'm flying new in that. But this go around I know all the bells and whistles and tricks so it'll go much better. Pulling motor tonight. It'll be out in a few hours completely. Ordered a new set of rings this morning. Then sometime next week I'll drop it all back in after I get everything refreshed (need to get my WB02 working and all).
Thanks for all the input everyone! Oh Mike I read up a lot on that site you sent me. Makes sense. I'm going to see if I can find a steel barb to have welded onto my intake pipe for a vac source on the AOS. It works fine without but works even better with one. Or I may build an external vac pump that gets triggered when needed.....there is a writeup on Nasioc on how to make one with a Corvette pump.
While it seems like the vacuum on the crank case is not the issue...I WAS trying to find something that could be wrong before you had to pull the motor. But it sounds like with that ring job you may have something a little more severe. I always try to look for the simple easy to fix stuff first before jumping on the major stuff.
Ill have to disagree with you there. There is a reason that even people that know how to build a motor choose to have there motor built by an Engine builder. I've seen plenty of motors built by reputable shops that run fine, I've also seen plenty that when pulled apart have rings folded over, or mis sized bearings. Its pretty easy to pull teeth but I'm not doing that myself either.
Everyone has their own opinions. I've built over 20 engines myself. Each new platform had it's problems on the first build that I learned from. I knew that coming into this one. I refuse to pay hundreds of dollars for some as simple as installing rings when I can do it just as well. It all boils down to my ultimate goals. I don't want the ability to blame anyone if something goes wrong. I can only blame myself. But at the same time I can truly say that 'I' built this engine myself and I take great pride in being able to do so.
Wirelessly posted (From Your Mom's House) Bahahahahahahahaha. :rofl: bahahahahahaha :rofl: bahahahahahaha :rofl: now that's funny...Sorry CoolRex.
And I've yet to see a Subaru of yours that you build last long.....nuff said. :unamused: Just because I listened to someone I trust more than anyone on here and misunderstood him doesn't mean I can't .
ROFL...Yeah, I think slowrx hit the nail on the head on that one. Sorry Coolrex, not bashing you but he does have a good point. Time is money to me and I can't afford the time to pull a motor 2-3 times because I screwed up something as simple as putting on rings. You could have paid a few hundred dollars to a machine shop but instead, you get to pull your motor again and hope you get it right this time.
It will be right this time Taking the block to a shop that does Subarus for a living and he will 'watch' over me. Giving me pointers and advice all while I do the work.
And yeah I have to pull the engine again but I'm actually enjoying it a lot so I'm not complaining. I was at first but tonight I enjoyed it.....and it's already out. Only took 2 hours.
so you gapped the oil control ring? I don't know of any motor design that calls for that did you do that on the DSMs you built?
You must be talking about the bugeye that popped a head gasket....yeah huge failure. Last I recall it got new headgaskets and ran fine. That car got parted out because my brother was tired of spending money on it. Thats the only one I "Built" so is that the one you speak of. Good luck with your engine
Yeah that the one I'm talking about. But whatever Matt you are always trying to downplay me and make me feel like a little ant. Then you will help when I ask. Maybe you are joking and pulling my chains but you always pick a fine time to do it :unamused:. :rofl: Thanks.
Motor is out and waiting on new rings that I ordered to come in. Then I'll be going to the shop on Saturday and installing them so no news until this weekend.
Rings should be in today. I'm going to go ahead and redo all of them. Tonight I'll be pulling the heads off the block. Saturday heading up to Epic to get the new rings installed and hopefully be running by Sunday night. Once I confirm that there are no leaks and all is well I will be scheduling appointment to have the car broken in on the dyno.