//Alex's Comments This thread contains conversation/content from another thread in our "Vendor Chat" forum. The thread was separated as the OT conversation was...OT. Yes, the conversation does pertain to tuning and tuning rates, but the discussion does not need to occur in that Sponsor/Vendor's thread. This new thread ultimately concerns anyone who is interested in having their vehicle tuned. Please keep responses "on topic" and as always no personal attacks. Please continue your discussions here. Thank you, //end
Sometimes the consumer wins, sometimes (bicycle industry) it destroys the local market and the small shop can't compete. Lets hope thats not the case here
Forged has always been flat-rate. Other shops have announced "tuning specials" this is hardly "devaluing" tuning. $450 is an appropriate amount to charge for a good tune. Siegel
Thats Bullshit and you know it. Its ok now since you guys are doing it. That doesn't fly with me and I don't care if you are a vendor or not. I have always called it like I see it and the way I see it is there is no reason to tune for a flat rate when there are so many variables involved, why should a shop suffer because of issues that are beyond its control. This is not good business period, I don't really care for the discounts Doug is doing either but flate rate isn't good for anyone except for the guy getting the eight hour tune thats only getting charged for three.
It's only Cobb Protuning (which is faster than Ecutek, OS, or stand-alone's) on "common setups." Anything other than the AP on a common setup will be more. Forged has been doing this for years. I didn't see you posting in Doug's thread... Siegel
sounds like communism to me, lol. rent control and minumum wage ultimately are bad things. there is always someone willing to work for less money and always someone willing to pay more for an apartment on the upper east side.... someone's gonna be effected, PERIOD
Just a suggestion. Maybe you should consult them on the fact that it "devalues tuning", rather than just letting them do what they do even though it's "wrong" (quotes are your words not mine). Just because they have been doing it/always have done it doesn't make it right. Or does it? Seems like the tuning police may be upset that they have been devaluing tuning for so long now and get them in check on that. extreme ex: Becky started stealing from Walmart when she was 5. She grew up to become a clepto and steals everyday now. It's not wrong because she has been doing it her whole life. Doesn't make much sense to me. In addition, I fail to see the big difference between flat rate and special? Is it that flat rate is long standing and a special is a short amount of time? If that is the case, then isn't the flat rate even MORE "wrong" because it goes on for longer than a special? One more Q—why is it that you get to decide what is appropriate for ALL of the tuning shops in the area? I'm almost positive Dan/Brandon/Matt have never called you about any of the specials you choose to run. I am asking a serious question here. So no flaming please. Just answers will suffice. I agree totally. That's why we were a little peeved to receive a phone call from Scott lecturing us on our tuning specials. Either way, Scott is right, it's "just Cobb". Cobb is pretty easy and kind of does most of the work for you from what I understand. It's not really rocket science.
Short explanation: Talking out of both sides of your mouth is a character flaw. Character flaws carry over into all aspects of ones activities. Not to mention, forums are for public discussions—no? Alas, sheeple will be sheeple.
Okay someone else can threadjack a thread and others can't? That sounds very fair. http://wrxatlanta.com/forums/showpost.php?p=342596&postcount=20
i'm talking about threadjacking a vendor's service offering as personal tit-for-tat response to a phone complaint made for the same reason. i dunno forged and don't owe them anything. scott's a friend but i don't owe him anything either. the comment was more about business owners acting and proceeding like business owners and not like highschool kids. the fact that i had to explain that, is embarrassing.
You are right and its gotten out of hand. Matter of fact (and for arguements sake I'm not going to name names) there are 2 tuning businesses that haven't gotten in the middle of this crap and acted unprofesssional. Acutally 3 but one uses the services of the other. It's just flat out embarrassing when you state a flat out FACT without any harsh or bashful words about or to anyone and you get called/texted/emailed all whining and complaining all about it. Some people say you can read between the lines.....whatever....you can do that with just about anything.
Sounds to me like BatlGround has a personal issue with Scott. Why not call us or Scott to discuss/complain instead of threadjacking and publicly making a big deal out of it? I understand you are displeased with Scott calling you previously, but at least he had the decency to call you on the phone. As new vendors on this site I do not see anything we have done to deserve this type of a response from another shop. We have been doing flat-rate tuning for years and it has worked out much better. The customer knows how much he/she is paying for a tune and doesn't have to worry about how long it will take. Mistakes can happen when you are trying to tune a car too quickly. This allows us to take our time to make sure the tuning is done to the best of our ability. I fail to see where the problem is, seems fair enough to me.
It's not just BatlGround fyi. I really do hope the best out of all worlds though. Now as far as flat rate tunes go.....I think they work well. I myself like to know for a fact how much it gonna cost me. The only time I don't agree is for a typical setup like a VF39/turboback exhaust/uppipe tune occurs. That takes 1-2 hours tops and should NOT cost $450. More like $250. But that is for the customer to decide and do. And that's 'MY' opinion which is just that...an opinion.
I for one could care less what other shops charge for tuning. It makes no difference one way or another to me. Customers will pick who they want to tune their cars based on their own decisions.
You can refer to me as Tracy I have the personal issue. I am not talking about Forged nor did I mention how you choose to do anything. I am talking about Scott and his words and shift in thought process. Period. I am fine with whoever wants to charge whatever. In fact, I am an advocate of that. It seems somehow you, amongst some others, missed that I made that same point. Coolrex, thanks for saying it so I don't have to So easy to make me into the bad guy because I have a big mouth and some love to hate me for it. I dare anyone to ever catch me in a lie. Won't happen. Never has. I said what I needed to. So, I'm out. See some of you Tuesday. I'll be the girl in purple spandex.
Well I look forward to the purple spandex and the bad attitude, as for my opinion, flat rates are for prostitutes and cell phone providers.
No problem Tracy. It's nice to know that you and I are in the same boat and that we are not alone in our opinions and thought. I am just like you Tracy....if I have an opinion I will voice it. I could care less what others think....there will always be people that agree and disagree.
i fail to see where you don't see the quintessential problem with your so called 'flat rate'. that's great that it has worked for years, and i completely understand if you don't change it. i'm not arguing that fact. i'm just arguing the fact that anyone doing this is screwing themselves AND screwing the customers at one point or another. either one of the following 3 scenarios will happen with ANY 'flat rate': A: the customer only requires work that anywhere else would have cost way less than $450 (i.e. just a touch up cobb 1 hour tune like wagunz_pwn's car scott did). in this situation the customer gets screwed B: everything is fine and dandy. the customer's car requires 2.8125hrs of tuning (assuming $160/hr) and it works out perfectly with shop fees and everything, BAM. this happens how often, honestly?? C: the customer has leaky vacuum hoses, some huge/mad/jdm/custom setup, funny problem difficult to diagnose, etc and it winds up taking scott (or whoever else tunes for you) all day (9am-4pm, cough cough been to plently of those tunes with scott). in this scenario, guess what the SHOP gets screwed. you could have had close to $1200 in tuning fees plus the other shop/disposal/bullsh*t fees but you only charged $450. that's the point im trying to make. i'm sure you guys have thought of this, and i can kind of see where some customers may appreciate this. but i think MORE CUSTOMERS will realize that tuning is just like any other service they have done to their vehicles and they will be charged PER HOUR. not saying your wrong, im saying the idea is wrong. again, like i said before like communism. just because its a good idea, doesn't mean it will work
Let it go Jake, the bandwidth is better used somewhere else than flogging this dead horse. Doug has said it best, and Sharif has agreed
i agree. just saying what is fundamentally wrong with it. im amazed you're not all over this, with all the anti-obama/communist/socialist republicans on the board
Hey Scooter... Are you saying after I get my clutch (or 6 spd) it'll set me back $450 to have you turn up the boost a little?
if you just left the car stock you would not have to worry about the cost of tuning at all. so everyone please just shut up all-ready. if you dont like the price dont go there. if you are dead set on Scott tuning your car then you will have to suck it up and pay what forged sets there prices at. if you dont care who tunes your car then go where ever you want and pay whatever that shop charges. end of story.
Checks, map drops, "custom limp maps made here," etc can be as little as $85 (half hour). Touch-ups / turn-ups that get on the dyno can be as little as $199. NORMAL setups WITHOUT mechanical issues will be a "risk-free" $450. (cars that have issues will have to pay for the mechanical work to fix the issues) Big / custom setups will be a "risk-free" $XXX on a case-by-case basis. When you call in to get a part installed you get a QUOTE on what the install will cost. This is more like that. Please don't think that if you need a touch-up it's gonna be $450. The intent here is to be fair to ourselves and the customers. We're "sharing" the risk On the EXTREMELY rare car that I spend less than 2.5 hours on (with strap-down fees etc) the customer might pay a LITTLE more, but won't have to worry about paying a lot more. For the customers that take a little longer, now they don't have to worry that I'm rushing, or that it's going to cost them $1k (which I don't think I've ever charged for tuning). Maybe I end up charging a little less, but most of the long ones had some kind of mechanical issue that will have to be paid for. Plus, it's not like this is all in stone. If it doesn't seem to work, we'll change it. There have already been a number of people that are quite happy with it. Some have asked to bring the cars in to pay for a mechanical check before-hand so that they are almost guaranteed of a $450 tune. It's an option that's intended to make it easier / less stressful for everyone. Siegel
We are $150 for the first hour, and then $100 each additional hour. If you and your buddy schedule for a tune on the same day then it will only be $100 an hour. Also if you make an appointment for tuning with us we will provide you with a limp map to drive the car to us free of charge. Figured.. I would post up our prices too..
Just for the record, limp maps that are sent out to customers that are coming here for tuning are still FREE here. The "custom limp maps dropped here" was a specific customer that wasn't sure if his poorly running car was mechanical or tuning. He brought it here and I drove around with him and dropped a few maps to make sure that he didn't have an additional issue. He only paid $80 I think, and now he knows that his tune should easily fall into the $450 worry-free zone Siegel