Just thought I would let people know who have not seen this yet or are not following it on any of the other forums. http://borgwarnerdealer.com/ http://www.cosworthusa.com/news/article.asp?idpage=57 http://www.full-race.com/articles/borgwarner-efr-turbos.html Some cliff notes: -Ball bearing and now have water cooling available if you want to use it -Integrated BPV that directs boost back to the compressor inlet so no need for an aftermarket BOV -50% lighter Gamma-Ti turbine wheel for quicker spool -VERY nice internal wastegate design but can still be used with external gates if you choose -Comes with an electronic boost controller -some factory location potential (Subaru and a couple others) models -Billet compressor wheels Seems like a pretty cool redesign of their turbo chargers. All the details are not out just yet, but the above article has some information as does the Full Race web site.
As a side note the stock location model that is coming out will still require a different downpipe than other stock location turbos.
So with this integrated BPV, will it work fine with MAF cars and relive the pressure through the inlet?
In theory, yes. It was designed to work better with MAF cars. According to Andy, there are some diesel turbos that have been using this BPV configuration in OEM applications for a couple years now with good results.
Which Diesel Engines are those? I thought most Diesel engines didn't have BPVs or BOVs since there is not throttle body to close. Where would it get its pressure signal or are they electronically controlled?
what are they using the speed sensor for, detecting compressor stall or surge? if it's a hall effect transmitter, I'm a little skeptical it will work at those speeds
To be honest I am not sure. I am sure you could shoot him a pm and ask him. They have also been using variable vane turbos for a while now too.
Ok clarification. The variable vane 6.0 powerstroke motors (which had throttle bodies from 2003-2005) would flatten their vanes upon throttle lift in order to aid in letting boost back into the wheel and to keep it moving. I mis-understood Andy in thinking that the turbos actually had internal bypass valves. They didn't have the valves, they just used the variable vanes to do something similar.
My understanding was that Powerstrokes used the variable vanes (VGT) like a brake. I don't think the Powerstroke diesels have a wastegate on the VGT motors. I would think that the vanes are acting more like an exhaust brake (jake brake) etc.... but by no means am I a diesel expert.
To be honest, I do not know that much about them. I have never spent much time playing with the OEM Ford Powerstroke diesel turbos. Andy is a Diesel Turbo Senior Master Technician (among about 15 other SR Master Tech certs) and knows quite a bit about them. I am just paraphrasing what he said. I am sure he could give you a dissertation on them though, lol. I know that there were changes in 2003 and then again in 2006. I also know they had a lot of issues out of the variable vane technology.
Release day finally and some more cool new stuff. I posted a new link and a couple more pics on the first post.
what a freakin package...wow. Interesting to see the price, and what kind of value they put on all these little options but man....
I hope these turn out to be great, however I'm not a fan of all the integrated crap. Its just more stuff to break and they seem to be hard to get spare parts from lately.
Well, you would need a custom downpipe or I am sure full race will be selling one. The max inlet size would be a max at about 500 whp. These should kill a 20G. THink more inline with the GT30/GT35 stock location turbos.
http://www.turbodriven.com/performanceturbos/matchbot/index.html turbo calculator. This is a fun little tool they have developed where you input the engine size, rpms, etc and it will plot it for you on the various compressor and turbine maps.
The flip side is that these can also be run in a more traditional configuration without the BPV or the wastegates. In fact the largest of the EFR turbos do not have the option in twinscroll configuration to even have internal gates. So these could be run with a traditional wastegate and traditional BOV and you would still reap the benefits of the 50% lighter turbine wheel, dual ball bearings and billet compressor wheel. I really am curious to see some results! More than that I am waiting on comparisons with EFR vs the older BW turbos and the EFR vs the new Garrett line.
http://www.full-race.com/articles/borgwarner-efr-turbos.html Pricing released. Click on the turbo you want a price on to see the available options and pricing. It is a little more than I thought it would be but only time will tell what these will actually sell for on the street.
Yeah, I didnt realize this until I went down to APR this past weekend. They had a pallet of Borg Warner K04's in their machine room. I took one out to look at it and it had the integrated BPV and boost control solenoid.
Yeah me too but I think those prices are full blown retail. I am going to guess they will sell for much less.
More clarification posts. There are two turbos in this line up that can potentially be bolted in a stock location. At this point it looks like you will need a modified up pipe or new up pipe and modified or new down pipe....not quite what I was expecting when they said "stock location."