Just trying to gauge interest of how many people are out there that have the accessport and would want a protune. We (TopSpeed) are considering getting the protune software as we have been getting alot of calls asking when we will carry the protune software. Discuss...
What price range would we be looking at? I am considering a StreetTuner purchase but once I get a new i/c it's unlikely I will mod further so a decently priced ProTune might be the ticket. So chalk one up for 'pretty interested'
Price hasn't been set in stone yet on the costs of a full custom Protune... but I am thinking it will be around 300 bucks for your first complete protune and then $120hr after that to retune it if you do additional mods and need some tuning.
With a ProTune you could conceivably store up to 10 maps on your AccessPort to run... it's also a nice way to get into custom tunes if you are already an AP owner.
I would definitely be interested! Quick question... you do not have to have purchased the street tuner software to get protuned, correct?
I have an AP and am set at the moment. However, if I decide to get more mods, I will be knocking on your door.
AP here and am ready to get protuned as other tuners have got very good results over the base AP Stage II Map.
so what can be different in these 10 maps... 02-03 ecutek allows switching between 2 maps but the only differences between the maps is boost
AP flashes ECU with a base map that replaces stock map. Feasibly, the AP could have another 9 maps that can be run real-time (connected to OBDII). They vary now from valet mode, economy mode, different octane levels, etc. I have never used a real time, b/c I don't want to run with the AP hooked up all the time. The real deal with protune is getting more hp/tq out of the conservative Cobb base maps. I've seen many LGT's on a protune eek out another 20hp/50tq over a standard Cobb base.
You don't need to leave the AP hooked up for realtime... you just hook it up to switch maps, no need to leave it connected. What they refer to as "realtime" maps are just maps that load into a different memory area in the ECU than the base map and can be switched "on the fly" without really flashing a complete new map. It only takes 5-10 seconds to do and then you disconnect the AP and throw in the glove box. As to the parameters available, Doug can probably answer that... it's a lot more than just boost though.
so the accress port is bought and then i would plug it in and the maps load to the car's ecu, right? then topspeed takes the maps and tweaks them? is this what's being talked about? sorry, still in the root learning level. i'll catch up soon, i promise!!
Yes, that is basically correct. I don't know if they would tweak the Cobb supplied maps or just roll their own.. it really doesn't matter though. The net result is you end up with custom maps for your car/setup on the AccessPort that you can load.
The way it would work is you would purchase the AP. Then bring the car to me, to have the car custom tuned for your setup. I would use my laptop hooked up to your ecu to do the custom tuning. The parameters that can be changed are almost just like Ecutek. Once the I am done tuning your car I load the map onto your hand held accessport. Now the killar thing is if you also want a race gas map I would tune your car, then again load the map onto your hand held accessport. This allows the customer the choice from switch between racegas and pumpgas maps when ever he wants. All you would have to do is select the map you want to run... hook the AP up to the car and load in the map. IIRC the AP will hold up to 10 different maps, so you could have a low boost, high boost, pumpgas, racegas, meth injection, even a valet map if you were to leave your car somewhere.
I've used the realtime economy map in the past... of course, it won't work now that I did turbo/injectors.
so u can have 10 COMPLETELY different maps with different rev limiters, AFR, timing, boost, etc... just want to clarify
You can apparently control a ton of stuff in each realtime map... (From Cobb's site) Real time map includes: Primary Fuel Map Primary Ignition Timing Map Knock Correction Map Boost Target Map Wastegate Duty Cycle Maps Turbo Dynamic Controls Intake Variable Cam Timing Advance Closed to Open Loop Transitions MAF sensor calibration Fuel injector size Rev limited Boost limiter
I agree.. Cobb definitely has the edge now: you can get the AP and run the staged maps for $500-600 total, then later on get ProTuned or buy StreetTuner for custom maps.
i wonder if ecutek is working on a handheld map 'bank'... it shouldnt be so hard for them to develop... i guess they have been pretty busy but they will lose a lot of customers if they don't offer that feature to compete with cobb until then, cobb would be the way to go for those who haven't bought any EM
Ecutek were supposedly working on a user tuning software too, that was to be released back in May... then it didn't get released and they ignored people's inquiries about it. Don't know if that's going somewhere or not; might be their way of fighting back now that Cobb released their new stuff this year.
Definetely interested here, I assumed the user would have to buy the AP tuner and then Doug would tune it.... but if I can pay 3 bills and have him tweek it with his tuner then I'm down!
Sounds good. Almost makes me regret Ecutek, but we'll see if any of this other fancy map switching/user tuning comes through.
so what's the total damage, money wise to get tuned?.....still kinda confused...i'm slow sometimes bear with me...cause Ecutek is like 850 + tuning time....right?
You can get an Accessport for around $500-600 (not too hard to find a used one) and then it looks like another $300 for tuning... so it'll come out to $800-900 total.
Well, look at it this way... For the $500-600 you get a set of staged maps you can use within a certain realm of modifications. The additional $ would be for a custom tune. So you can "get started" for less and you could conceivably run a lot more maps if you wish... not sure what all Doug would do for $300 though.
Plus the AP can be easily sold when you sell the car. I think this ability to recoup some of the cost is the biggest plus. You can sell your ECU after ECUTek also i believe, but not nearly as easy.
maybe with wrx, but i think you can't just change out ecu in sti's. maybe someone will chime in, but i beleave scott said that the ecu mates to your wiring harnass in sti's
Most of AP staged maps work great if you follow their path of upgrades.. however there are those customers out there that like to mod their car more. Doing turbo upgrades larger injectors... etc.. that would see huge benifits from a protune. As most of the off the shelf maps for large turbo cars.. are quite tame to say the least.
correct on the 05 and newer model subaru's the ecu's immobilizer must sync with the key. If its not than the car will not start. You would need the dealership to flash the new ecu for your immobilizer.
Very true, but even with the right mods the whp #s vary widely since no WRX is the same and COBBs maps are conservative for reliability. People who have been running Stg 2 (I'm currently on stg2 w/o Protune, so I have yet to experience) have seen gains anywhere between 15-25 hp over the off-shelf map. And as Doug said, once you do extra mods like an uppipe, headers, TMIC, yadda yadda you could squeeze even more hp out of your car which you couldn't w/ off-shelf maps. Huge bang for the buck IMHO.
With the '05+ 2.5 turbo (any car with the immoblizer) your ECU cannot run in any other car. You can buy a NEW ECU and put it in, but once a car has run on an ECU, it can't be installed in anything else... SS
VW's have the same thing but you can get the SKC Key from the dealer so you can run an ECU from another car in yours. Wonder if and when Subaru will do this. It must be possible because, you can take an ecu off the shelf and run it in your car. Why throw away a perfectly good ecu vs resetting it.
Doug, Would an AP with a Protune then be your recommendation for us MY 05 STi owners over an Ecutek then? Pricewise, the two seem comparable, but with the ability to keep 9 spare maps on board seems to give the nod to AP over Ecutek. Thoughts? I'd like to move into the EM world soon and have heard different recommendations on IWSTi. Seeing as how two of the most reputable tuners of Ecutek in the nation are in the neighborhood, I'd like to pose the question to you (and Scott if you're listening also). If I were to ask you point blank for a sales pitch over one of the other, what would it be?
Basically it comes down to personal choice.. imho. Both will most likely make the same power. Only benifit of the AP right now is the switchable maps... but that most likely will change soon as Ecutek is releasing their own version of the switchable maps called EZ-ECU which will allow ecutek users the same ability to switch maps. Main reason I got the Protune software was to be able to cater to a larger crowd that needs tuning. PS. My protune software will be here Tuesday.
Doug, I got 232hp with AP stage 2 with the mods listed below... How much more do you think you could squeeze out of her with the current mods? Trying to gauge if it'd be worth it...
One question i got the AP and im stage 2 now for a protune would i have to buy the streetturner kit or with your protun i just pull in and let you do what you do and store on my handhelp and go with it. cause i dont have to spend the 400$ on the street turner then im much happier.
You would not need Street Tuner. That is only if you want to tune things yourself. However, that reminds me of a question I wanted to ask... Doug, I think Cobb allows you to either 'open' the ProTune map so that a Street Tuner owner can tweak it, or lock it. Which will you be doing, or does it not matter much to you?