I'm still new to the Subaru scene so I figured the Newbie section would be he way to go. The mod bug got me before I even bought the car and I looking at bumping up the power. I'm just wondering which tuner to go with, SOG or TopSpeed. Both seem reputable but TopSpeed isn't at a dealership and is a little closer to my house. Anybody with experience with with either shop? Thanks
Flip the coin and decide. Both are awesome place. Can't go wrong with either one. I would say big difference is Scott @ SOG does Road tuning and Doug @ Topspeed does dyno tuning.
both are good but i have always had my car tuned at SOG and have been EXTREMELY satisfied... scott puts a lot of time into the car to make it run like it came from the factory
SOG. SS is probably one of the most dedicated people I know when it comes to getting it fast and safely. Just my opinion.
Really you cant go wrong with either choice. Both Scott and Doug are GREAT tuners with great repuations around the country. Talk to both of them, and see which fits you better.
I went to doug at Topseed to get my tuning done. I came all the way from Savannah. All the guys were cool and they dropped stuff that they were doing to work on my car. I haven't been to SOG but I hear good things about them.
i would go with any1 of them and since top speed is closer and u have ur pick.. but then scott does work like he is doing on his own car.. thats Love. pick it and stick it.. simple
I'm not really familiar with road tuning. Can you get the same level of results without seeing multiple dyno graphs and hard numbers? Does SS still give you a whp/wtq measurement?
I would have to say Scott....been with him on a lot of tunes, a lot of tunes and always does a great job.
+2 for SS ...wait i think i just reposted myself yep, so should that be +4 for SS??? anywho, he's damn good!
Its more accurate than dyno tuning as it is a real world situation; granted, certain dynos can simulate this real world nature, nothing is as balanced as the real thing. Yes, he will be able to give you a measurement. However, he will be more than happy to throw your car on the dyno as well to give you a final estimate (this will cost 1 hour of dyno time most likely).
ok I've been thinkin about this alot... No offense to both tuners... just thinking out loud. I don't exactly understand why road tuning is whole lot better. I know it's tuning in real world situations but... wouldn't it also depend on what day he tunes it 'cuz there's no such thing as constant temperature and constant wind flow... As for Scott being a perfectionist, I respect that and I believe that's why most people vouch for him... but I hear he takes alot longer to tune. So say that Scott takes 3 hours to tune... give that 3 hours to Doug at TopSpeed instead of an hour that he normally takes, wouldn't he be able to make it as perfect as Scott??? Again I am no tuner... just a guy selling parts and interested in learning more about cars as much as you do and love modifying my car. This is came in to my attention and have been thinkin about it alot discussing with buddies of mine. We do business with both TopSpeed and Scott... again I'm not vouching for anyone but just expressing how I feel. Feel free to make comments on it, that's what the this forum is for right?
+1 for SS. I have driven the same car tuned by both places, and the tune by SS was much smoother. Siegel really puts a lot of effort into his tuning, and it shows when you drive the car. -- Brian
i have never had my car tuned by doug so i cant comment on the quality of his tunes... i have been happy with scott and have had no reason to leave people argue for and against road tuning... i have heard the topspeed dyno (dynojet) actually recreates conditions similar to the road... and it does that much better than the SOG dyno (dynapak)... if scott had dynojet, i think he would also do a lot more dyno tuning personally, i like both forms of tuning... when u road tune, u can see how the car reacts to real heat exchange at the radiator and intercooler... i doubt the little fans that sit in front of the dyno are good enough... when u dyno tune, u can see what change made more power rather than just guess... during a road tune u can compare the area under the torque curve (the paramater that actually matters more than peak numbers) by timing how long it takes u to pull a gear from a pre-selected start rpm to a pre-selected stop rpm... so in the end, they both have benefits and disadvantages... both are good tuners and that is evident from the cars they produce... i personally have only had scott tune my car and have been very happy with results... hence i recommend him since my recommendation goes hand in hand with my credibility... the same way as people who get their cars tuned by doug will always recommend him... once again, they are both good tuners and u can't go wrong either way
well, like everyone and their mothers said, it's a choice that comes down to whether you want a road tune or dyno tune. You CANNOT go wrong with either of them. I personally had Scott tune mine and haven't thought twice about it (very happy with my tune <3 SS). I **think** Doug will do a road tune if you ask him to, should you choose to go with him. Just comes down to talking with the two and deciding from there.
I still love Doug I think road tuning just shows load on the car better since it is "real" load. I think whether you go to Scott or Doug, your numbers will be similar (maybe, never dealt with SS), so I don't think it's a big deal. I like TopSpeed because it doesn't have the dealership feel. Went to SoG when I was in ATL the other day to find an o2 sensor and it didn't really impress me. Now, that old beat up white truck with the NX kit and 1000hp that tows boats around at TopSpeed impresses me :naughty:
After being tuned by both, I have to give another + to SS. Both are excellent tuners, but I like the fact that SS is backed by a Dealership.
You can never get a dyno to simulate the load exactly like the street does. Spool up is almost always faster on the street. My experince has been that if you log a car on the dyno and then take it off the dyno and log it on the street its always slightly leaner on the street. Matt
My two cents, Scott and I have allways had a great working relationship. With that being said I have nothing bad to say about Scott or his tuning. Scott tends to tune more on the road than I do, for one main reason. His dyno is a pain in the ass to setup a car and get it ready to dyno. Unlike mine which takes about 5 minutes. I choose to dyno tune most cars so I don't have to do full throttle pulls up and down the street. Now for most cars, and I say most a dyno tune will load the car just as it would on the street. IE: I tune a car on the dyno, and on the street the same AFR's and same boost level are achieved. Now for those extra few cars that make say over 500hp you will always see the car lean out a bit on the street compared to the dyno due to a different load. This is when I usually do a lengthy road tune afterwards, unlike the short road tune I do after every other car I tune. In the end if you want me to do a road tune and spend 3-5 hours tuning it I have no issue doing so Its just going to cost you alot more money..
I haven't been tuned by either yet, but they are both class acts and I would go to either one. I have no preference. I know that they are both extremely professional and extremely knowledgable in their craft. So....a big thumbs up for both Scott and Doug... they just do their tuning in a different way, and each one has a different methodology...Just my 2 cents... Mark
It's also important to remember that it's not like Doug doesn't have access to roads (or Scott a dyno) to tune on if you want him to. Doug (and Scott for that matter) could/would tune either way if you wanted them to, so long as you're paying for it. My suggestion would be to at least call and talk to both of them about what to expect. After talking with both, you may feel more comfortable with one than the other. Ultimately, both seem to have produced excellent tunes. You really can't go wrong either way.
I have ahd my car tuned by both, I just had mine retuned by Scott at SOG and am VERY pleased at the results. But eaither way you choose to go you should be satisfied.
I've been tuned by both and I have to say SS is HANDS down the way to go! Topspeed tuned my car twice and the first tune was okay but I had a bad leaking up-pipe. The second tune was just horrible. I wouldn't hold boost and ti spiked and fell and the car buckled and knocked. After trying to get in touch with Topspeed Doug was always too busy to talk (no offense Tray but I wanted to talk directly with the tuner) and in my opinion customer service is a must. I gave them two weeks to at least let me know something and it was always the same thing....too busy. Plus I have two friends in Charleston who came home knocking like crazy but they adjusted the tune by decreasing the timing a little themselves since they both had UTEC's. I called up SS and he answered and took the time to help me out. He talked with me and answered all my questions immediately. I must've talked to him for 30 minutes. Anyways he tuned my car and it not only felt tens times better but I was amazed at how smooth it was. Scott taught me sooooo much about my car explaining what he was doing when he was tuning and why he was doing so. You get hands on learning with Scott. I returned a few months later with meth inj and the story was the same. Now I have to STRESS this. Yes Doug tunes fast 1-2 hrs. Scott takes longer but he is VERY reasonable. Scott is so meticulous with his tunes that even one little blip in the AFR or timing curve is going to be fixed. That dedication and precision alone was enough. I can honestly say that when you leave with a tune from Scott you have nothing to worry about and your car will fell soooooo SMOOTH.
Not only is Scott a good tuner but he is a great driver, so you can make him give you tips on driving while your getting your car tuned.
I agree. He always drives like he is on the track, picking lines on off ramps and stuff. Very educational. All the Tuning stuff is just way over my head.
he says he works for the dealership (he wears a SOG shirt) and that the customer brought the car in cause it causes problems under full throttle :rofl: