what part of illegal do i not understand??? do you think i could go to France, Japan, or wherever and protest if i was an illegal immigrant? hell no...i'd be thrown in jail in 2 seconds. in now way am i racist, but c'mon folks...we can't logistically just open up the flood gates (borders) to just anyone. some may disagree w/ me and think we should just let anyone work and live here, and other's may agree. care to discuss?
Yea the whole concept of this is just plain dumb. But since I work at a gas station and nobody really came in today, it was great!
I agree with you, some come over illegally been here for 10-20 years plus and not legal not tryin to be then they dont learn the language but we are expected to learn theirs open up a business tax free of course and send money back home the hispanics/mexicans etc is just the tip of the ice berg there not the only ones just the ones makin the stink right now. what I'm worried about is the next terrorist commin over just like some of them and causing havoc again.
did u know 60 + % of buildings u see everyday was or is made by an illegal immigrant because all those citizenship people were trying to make billions staying at home dieing of heart attack, trying to get a job at telemarkting.. and all we had was illegal immigrants to work the lowest of the lowest jobs to just make ur living ez... look at the WM truck comming every week at ur house all u will see is 50% illegal immigrants and 50% citizens.. i mean come on.. they come here to work the lowest jobs which u and i dont wanna do.. give them a break, if they come for work give them if we dont i'm sure u and i wont do it.. i mean come on do u see indian guys doing hard labor? i mean give us a calulater and we will do ur tax's mann.. lol j/k but serious think abt it.. i work in a gasstation or used to.. and trust me every guy who came there 70% were illegal.. and 30% were legal..
i totally agree with being against this whole business. One thing to think about though, i bet not a single one of us could pass the citizenship test that is given out on US history without studying for 2 weeks. My russian roommate who recently got nationalized showed me some of the questions and i could only answer a fourth of them! Some reform is needed in that department to give immigrants a reasonable oppertunity for legal work and citizenship so they dont have to run the rio grande gauntlet. Yes, we get the point that the unskilled labor is the backbone of the southwest and inner city economy but this is the completely backasswards way to go about protesting it.
I undrestand your point but still if you gonna be here get legal period. and if I gotta work somewhere I don't like I'm going to do it vs living off gov't if I can help it. prob. right, but that's all Im sayin do what you gotta do to be here legal
I disagree with the whole protest thing. It seems very odd to be protesting the fact that what they are doing is illegal and has been for so long. Like someone else said its not like you can just go anywhere else and do the same thing legally. You would be punnished and thrown out! I have nothing against any race or type of people but if you are going to come to our country do it legally, or atleast try to become legal to your best ability!
but to become legal they need to have amenisty which i hope aproves last time it did was in bill cliton years and alot of my friends got legal. all indian but the thing is.. when they come here with no papers ie:- crossing borders risking lives, just to come and work to make bread and send some bak to they can live peacefully thats nuttin wrong in it.. but for them to get legal is a battle they might or might not win...but all i'm saying is whatever happens does happen for good right now USA is a world power maybe in 5 or 10 years sum1 eles is a world power.. or super power the cycle goes on no matter what..
I think that the concept of them protesting is a little ridiculous. Now I'm not saying that I want to get rid of every illegal immigrant, because like previously stated, they do lots of hard work; However, I just can't believe the audacity that they have to protest something like this. They are illegal immigrants. They are breaking the law. Basically they should take what they can get and not complain about it. It's like a car theif complaining to auto manufacturers because their cars come with security systems. I know that's a tad extreme, but really, same sort of deal. eh, my .02
WRxCrazy...you do have valid points yes. I totally understand the many ppl that want the opportunity like us Americans to prosper. I am all about anyone and everyone having the luxery's that we have and take advantage of in life. However, we cannot just open the borders up to anyone to cross over. Like every other country...there is immigration laws for a purpose. For security reasons (terrorist), drug enforcement, and to make sure whoever is going live here will be a productive member of society. To just come here illegally and expect to have rights to protest still doesn't jive with me. Illegal means NOT obiding by the law...correct? If you're breaking the law...you have no rights as far as I'm concerned. BTW...let's keep this a mature clean debate as it has been so far. Thanks. -Shane edit* oh yeah, i like how i've seen on the news where the reporters would ask an individual about his employees, on if they were given the day off to protest, and if any of them are undocumented employees...and their response is "uhhh, i am not going to comment whether they are undocumented, or not." actually saw that a few times on Fox News. pretty much trying to protect themselves because they're is breaking the law, and doesn't want to get in trouble. realistically it doesn't make sense to me.
I agree completely. There are enough unemployed people in America who need jobs that are being taken by illegal workers. I wouldnt have as much of a problem if they all at least took the courtesy to learn our language since they live in our country. I always hated working at restaurants and not being able to communicate with the dishwashers because they can barely understand english, and their English skills are kinda subjective depending on their laziness on that day. Has anybody been to the Subway off Peachtree St where instead of actually interacting with the worker you simply order your sandwich on a computer screen and watch the employee make your sub. They just need a cashier who can speak english enough to run the cash register.
keep in mind that while the corp side of this debat is about penalties for corp sheltering illegals... and, there are plenty of manual labor jobs that these people are requested for. meaning there are people here requesting them to be here because of the cheap labor cost. in a word, exploitation(albeit mutually beneficial on some levels). also keep in mind that many places in europe allow cross-border employment/driver license recognition. we need a constructive solution to this that isn't a political pander... and i'm afraid pandering is what we're going to get. but in the strict sense of the law, no they do not possess the right assemble and demonstrate. citizens do, which they aren't. but my hope is that through these demonstrations some people will learn just why/how these people come here.
Basically we've shot our selves in the foot. We worry too much about being politically correct these days. 20 years ago if these criminals had protested the way they are today they would've been handled instead of felt sorry for but I guess there's not much we can do about that. The way I see it is we can't afford to just dish out all these services to illegals because none of us will ever even see services like social security or medicare in our time as it is. So the last thing we need is for people who don't care about our laws to just continue to use up our goods and services. If they drive on our roads, send their kids to our schools, use our public transportation and basically just enjoy life in the US the way we do without paying taxes, then they might as well just be taking the money right out of our pockets because we are the ones footing the bill for them.
People who told you that illegals don't pay taxes. Everyone has to pay but the thing is that they don't get any taxes back. And trust me Americans working outside in the rain in the cold or in the hot sunny days; yeah I don't think I have seen one in a couple of years!!!!
<venting> Argument 1: The whole illegals are law breakers doesn't work for me. America was founded on immigration and I'm don't blame a single "illegal" for trying to make a better life for themselves. I don't think carte-blanche amnesty is the answer, but a some type of citizenship program is. They need to be incorporated and pay taxes. Otherwise their disaffected children who are born here, and hence citizens, will become a major problem(crime, poverty, etc.). If you get hung on their "law breaking" you're a hypocrite. A country with so many lawyers and politicians can't help but come up with *STUPID* laws, including some of the immigration laws. Just read the CL Blotter. A girl was arrested for "pedestrian soliciting a car ride". WTF? Asking for a car ride is illegal too? She must be an "illegal" citizen. Whatever. Kudos to "legal" immigrants though. Argument 2: The protest is over legislation currently being reviewed in the house that would make it easier and more common to get otherwise law abiding immigrants booted out. Like some of you said, these people have been living and working in America for a long time, and now. If you are competing against them for jobs, tough shit. Welcome to the world economy everyone is dealing with. You want to close our borders, tax imports, ignore other nations problems? Isolationism will kill America faster than any terrorist. </venting>
Well I'm no hypocrite. I do pay taxes and obey the laws though, and I don't openly proclaim that I don't care about the nations laws. Do Americans do all the shitty jobs? No, but guess what. If all the illegal aliens left tomorrow somebody would damn sure do them. The nation will not just shut down. One thing I do believe in though, is that if citizens of other countries serve in the US military that it should be easier for them to get citizenship, and that's because I have a lot of hispanic friends that I serve with who I feel should be given a break because of thier service.
My major issue with the subject is that they want to be Americans, yet they choose to protest on the Mexican Labor Day. If they want to protest about a labor related issue, do it on the AMERICAN labor day. My point is they just need to make up their minds about their nationality. I don't celebrate German Labor Day, I don't force everyone to learn German because I refuse to learn English. I appreciate all the work that immigrants do in this country, because I know most of us sure as heck wouldn't want to do it, but the protest was not thought through very well.
Care to expand on that one? The one thing that pisses me off more than anything is people yelling and screaming about 'national security' being the reason to close off the US-Mexico border. Give me a freakin' break. None of the 9/11 hijackers entered through Mexico, though a lot of people seem convinced that was the case. Hell, they all had visas from the State Department. If border security is such a big deal, why don't we build a wall by the Canadian border? In fact, out of the 946 people of non-Mexican nationality that got caught crossing our borders in the three years following 9/11, 320 were caught at the Mexican border and _472_ at the Canadian one. As to the original issue: it's nice to say that they 'should come here legally' and all, but just how easy is it to get into the US legally from Mexico? And let's face it, there is no stopping what's going on: there are few other places in the world where the wealth disparity is so great in two neighboring countries like these. People WILL find a way to make it over here, so let's just try and find a way to have them become legal residents and workers.
u can't simply blame illegal immigrants for taking jobs... an equal fault lies in the hands of the employers who offer them employment... if these employers only hired people legally, there would be no problem of americans losing jobs to aliens... they are breaking the law just as much as the aliens are
yeah i feel if u are willing to die for the country in which you are serving, then you have that right to become a citizen. isolating the US from other nations is not the answer yes; however, letting anyone and everyone just come cannot logistically happen. our cities/communities are slowly becoming overpopulated. just look at the city or town you group up in...i'm sure it has grown a lot since we were kids. what kills me is some of the protestors are waving their countries flags, but in reality some of them are here illegally because they have deserted their country because of poverty. let's go to another country and start waving our US flag and demanding rights. yeah we'll see what happens there. when people say, "you cannot ignore other countries problems" i'm thinking well we still have homeless people on our streets suffering. we have our problems so why don't we take care of our own before thinking about others. i just don't think other countries would do the things we have done for other's. but that's a whole other subject in itself.
If you think about it you pay taxes and you get a tax return. They pay taxes but they don't get anything back they are illegals remember. How you ask they get a fake green card & social security and pay taxes and so that the companies they work for won't say any thing.
I just wish the Mexican government would get thier stuff together. The problems at home are what have made the Mexican people want to come to the US and that's only in the last two decades. Before the poverty in Mexico got so bad things were different.
I don't mean to be rude, but that's not really how the income tax system works. You get a refund when you *overpay* taxes, not by the grace of Uncle Sam. Contrary to popular belief, a tax refund isn't a good thing; it's you giving the government what essentially amounts to an interest free loan over the past year. It might be argued that immigrants pay taxes but don't benefit from tax funded services. However, it does appear that they take some advantage of public schools, health care etc. Sure, they won't see any social security checks in the future but hell, neither will we...
Do this I pay $9000 in taxes have a house a child and I get $1000 back do you think thats how it should work. I know some american families that don't make much money and get $4000 back and they have kids and rent appartments and are on medicare and welfare. But then again they drive 06 cars.
actually have you been listening to the news lately? most are waving OUR flag. not that it should be a "free pass"... just saying
If you pay $9k and get $1k back, you should only have paid $8k in the first place. That said, I agree that illegal immigrants who pay taxes by use of fake Tax IDs / SSNs do not get the benefit of earned income credits, child tax credits etc etc... but then again, we don't know how much they really pay in tax; the deductions are based on exemptions claimed etc so they may well be paying a lot less than a legal worker with the same income would. And they won't get in trouble for it since they won't be filing come April 15.
I like what Jon Stewart said last night: what's the point of showing that they are willing to come here and work hard by taking the afternoon off? :rofl:
the news sites are showing both US and foreign flags. photo from the CNN website: Wearing a sombrero and waving a mexican flag doesn't do much to promote getting amnesty in order to be a legal citizen in this country... Talk to people who have followed the legal way of becoming a citizen in this country, and you have a different opinion on this situation. -- Brian
With 10 exemptions, you do not pay any federal taxes on your payroll check. You will still be liable for state and SS taxes though. But those are typically minimal for the pay rate that these illegals get. Plus, how many employers actually put these illegals on the books? very few. Most employers pay them petty cash, which is completely tax free, unreported, and mostly sent to their home country. We need two things: Enforce the existing laws Tax all money transfers to other contries. - Of course if we went to a national sales tax, we wouldn't have to worry about trying to get tax money from them, as everything they bought would take care of the tax benefit they are getting now.
I'm sorry, but FTS. I am already paying enough taxes on the money I make here; I have no desire to pay even more when I eventually take it with me somewhere else.
As a LEGAL immigrant of US, I believe that the protest is very pointless. What are they trying to accomplish?? What have we (US Govt, US citizens, and legal immigrants) done wrong??? Did we put them in Jail for crimes that they did NOT commit?? Did we overcharge whenever they go out shopping?? did we reject them when their children go to public schools?? When the II(illegal immigrant) mother delivers a baby on US soil, she does it for FREE. When that baby go visit the doctor, they pay nearly nothing for all the services since the CHILD is now the citizen of the GREAT United States of America. What do they want more?? I sound like cold-hearted person, but most of time I have sympathy on them. cuz I know how it is as an immigrant to live in this country. That's why i'm extra nice to people who don't speak english that well. BUT this protest tells me that they are not appreciated to people who live here. Even more, they are like requesting more and more stuffs for their own selfishness. Sometimes I wish that I can get paid in CASH!! (no deductibles) That's like you are getting 20-30% pay raise!!
I don't think we should keep on giving them so much for free either. What I want it for us to limit the amount of people that can come in and freeload off of us. And lets get this thing under control before it gets violent.
let them be citizens if they can pass everything a normal immigrant is required to pass to become a citizen. oh, and make them take english classes.
as far as the arguement goes on how it is currently too hard to become a citizen: I'm sure the test is hard, don't know from experience, but that being said....If learning spanish fluently and studying mexican history would increase my annual salary by even a few grand or more I would be telemundo FTW!!!!
typically, the issue with immigration is that you need to have have a job that is currently in short supply, and then you can get granted a green card to work in the country for that job...
i read this somewhere, thought i would post it here. It is a very good example of people like Jang, and maybe oneday Moose
walk out? I went to mexican resturants for lunch the last 2 days and had no issues at all. People left work?
i know at the restauraunt I work for on the weekends they had already walked out once so my GM said If they walked out again they were in serious risk of losing there jobs.....they decided to stay this time around